Doesn’t shed much light on Lowe’s injury or the recovery or O’Brien and Milne. Rugby clubs, certainly the Irish sides, are overtly opaque when it comes to injury updates.
Shows disregard for the fans and a naivety over the effective communications and public relations required for a commercial sports organisation
They are not allowed to due to privacy laws in this country, it's nothing to due with Leinster Rugby or the IRFU.
No sure I buy that. There are varying degrees of injury information issued as it stands. The frustration is that it’s inconsistent and often misleading. Also, disclosure would surely be permitted with player consent.
In the ‘new’ GDPR world it’s not so much a case that disclosure is permitted with player consent it’s more a case that disclosure is only permitted with player consent. Since Jamie Heaslip’s ‘run in’ with the media over his back injury more and more players are choosing to keep their medical information private.
It’s really none of our business what the specifics of their injury are and having the information in the public domain may come against them re insurance, in any negotiations with other clubs or even in terms of giving the opposition information on where they may have a potential weakness.
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Any release of medical information requires explicit consent. That means that a player who is injured for 4 weeks can consent on week 1, refuse consent on week 2, give qualified consent on week 3 and withdraw that again on week 4. If I were a professional rugby player, I would never give consent to be honest. I don't want future employers to know my past injury history - they can have a fitness test when I'm in the process of signing.
You would be required to disclose injury history to a new club for insurance purposes. That’s not why any injury details are kept out of the public domain.
Serb wrote: ↑January 26th, 2022, 12:19 am
You would be required to disclose injury history to a new club for insurance purposes. That’s not why any injury details are kept out of the public domain.
Sorry Serb, I think we're at cross purposes, I wasn't clear - I'm talking about that initial phase when a player is shopping himself around new clubs. When he signs (or is signing) then of course he will have to make certain disclosures - but the first thing a DOR will do when he is offered a player by an agent is to google him and you don't want stuff turning up there.
There are clear and extensive injury updates issues in NFL and European soccer, where the stakes (monetarily) are significantly higher for players.
I think it’s naive to say it’s none of our business - fans and media generate revenue for clubs and players alike, people naturally discuss who’s injured and when they’ll return, in the lead up to matches, it’s all part of following a sports team. The main rugby headline today is Carbery’s return from injury sooner than expected…
Blue Man wrote: ↑January 26th, 2022, 8:08 pm
There are clear and extensive injury updates issues in NFL and European soccer, where the stakes (monetarily) are significantly higher for players.
I think it’s naive to say it’s none of our business - fans and media generate revenue for clubs and players alike, people naturally discuss who’s injured and when they’ll return, in the lead up to matches, it’s all part of following a sports team. The main rugby headline today is Carbery’s return from injury sooner than expected…
Might be wrong here but GDPR is european law and does not effect NFL - where a players well-being has become much more than just important for their team but the massive industry that is fantasy football. Rugby is a full contact sport while soccer isn’t (again some might take me up on this and state that it is) and the physical well-being of a players ability to take hits is more important, but that is just my opinion
Players likely out of contract, ages as of the start of next season:
LH Prop
Cian Healy(34/Belvedere/Clontarf) - central contract until 2022
Ed Byrne(29/Clongowes/UCD) - signed contract in 2020
Peter Dooley(28/Birr RFC/Lansdowne) - signed contract in 2020
Healy is coming off a central contract and its assumed he will probably sign a contract to get him to the next world cup. Byrne and Dooley looks under pressure for a contract, presumably one will stay and one will leave.
TH Prop
Vakh Abdaladze(26/Coolmine RFC/Clontarf) - signed contract in 2020
Vakh looks set to stay at leinster, i'd say.
Hooker
Sean Cronin(36) - signed 1 yr contract in 2021
Dan Sheehan(24/Clongowes/Lansdowne) - signed contract in 2020
Lots of talk about Sheehan but appears he has re-signed with Leinster, Cronin is presumably in his last year with Leinster.
Lock
Devin Toner(36/Castleknock/Lansdowne) - signed 1 yr contract in 2021
Josh Murphy(27/St. Michaels/UCD) - signed contract in 2020
Jack Dunne(23/St. Michaels/DUFC) - signed contract in 2020
Ryan Baird(23/St. Michaels/DUFC) - signed contract in 2020
Charlie Ryan(23/Blackrock/UCD) - Academy Yr 3
Brian Deeny(22/Wexford RFC/Clontarf) - Academy Yr 3
Lots of talk about Dunne and appears he is leaving for Exeter, Toner is presumably in his last year with Leinster. Murphy has emerged as a viable option at lock and it would be a surprise to see either him or Baird leave. Ryan hasn't played a game of rugby in over a year and is presumably leaving, Deeny has had his own injury issues, might he stay on for another season in the academy?
Backrow
Rhys Ruddock(31/Exile/St. Marys) - signed contract in 2020
Josh Van Der Flier(29/Wesley/UCD) - signed 2 yr contract in 2020
Dan Leavy(28/St. Michaels/UCD) - signed contract in 2021
Will Connors(26/Clongowes/UCD) - signed contract in 2020
Max Deegan(25/St. Michaels/Lansdowne) - signed contract in 2019
Caelan Doris(24/Blackrock/DUFC) - signed contract in 2020
Martin Moloney(22/Athy RFC/Old Belvedere) - Academy Yr 3
Could either Doris or JVDF be in contention for a central contract? It's possible. Ruddock could look to move abroad given he has fallen down the depth chart with Ireland, but I'd be surprised if Leinster werent very keen to keep him. Connors has spent the guts of a year injured, presumably his target is still to make the world cup and he will stay with leinster with the aim of doing that? Deegan might be the most under pressure to move, difficult to project what happens there. Leavys injury cant have been good news but you'd assume he is another player keen to get healthy and re-assert his position. Moloneys leinster future could be decided based on what happens above him, if Leinster retain all their older backrows, I can't see there being a contract for him, but thats a big IF.
Scrumhalf
Jamie Gibson Park(30) - signed 3yr contract in 2019
Cormac Foley(22/St. Gerards/Lansdowne) - Academy Yr 3
JGP is coming of contract at the perfect time for him given his status with Ireland, there doesnt appear to be a central contract available for him after Murray re-signed, presumably he will re-sign with Leinster. Foley has had a strong season at AIL level, but are leinster looking to carry 4 senior scrumhalves?
Outhalf
Jonathan Sexton(37/St. Marys/St. Marys) - central contract until 2022
Ross Byrne(27/St. Michaels/UCD) - signed contract in 2020
Harry Byrne(23/St. Michaels/Lansdowne) - signed contract in 2020
David Hawkshaw(23/Belvedere/Clontarf) - signed contract in 2021
Sexton looks to be inevitably staying on for another year until the WC. Ross Byrne will have offers from elsewhere, will he be happy to stay at Leinster while being out of the picture for Ireland? Harry presumably is happy to stay at leinster, while Hawkshaw has spent the season playing AIL, will he be happy to stay or might he be attracted to a move west?
Centre
Robbie Henshaw(29) - central contact until 2022
Conor O'Brien(26/Mullingar RFC/Clontarf) - signed contract in 2019
Ciaran Frawley(24/Skerries RFC/UCD) - signed contract in 2019
Liam Turner(23/Blackrock/DUFC) - Academy Yr 3
Henshaw is undoubtedly talking with the IRFU, Frawley may come under pressure to move north and pursue playing 10, though I expect him to stay at leinster at the moment. COB's injury issues make it look unlikely to me that he will be here beyond next season, while I can't see Turner getting a senior contract with Jamie Osborne likely moving onto a deal instead of him.
Back Three
Adam Byrne(28/Naas RFC/UCD) - signed contract in 2020
Rory O'Loughlin(28/St. Michaels/UCD) - signed contract in 2020
Jordan Larmour(25/St. Andrews/St. Marys) - signed contract in 2020
Tommy O'Brien(24/Blackrock/UCD) - signed contract in 2020
I can't see both Byrne and ROL staying at leinster, presumably one will leave. Larmour presumably extends with Leinster in order to make the world cup. TOB has had a lot of injury issues but I can't see him leaving leinster yet.
Last edited by mildlyinterested on January 27th, 2022, 11:34 am, edited 1 time in total.
That would add up to a lot of turnover. Not unrealistic though that we could be a squad cut if the shorter calendar is here to stay. Last year was very different.
Is Josh Murphy a viable option in the 2nd row? I mean I really hope so, but even Tom Denton could have looked like a world beater against Bath and Montpellier. I still feel like we could use another signing along with Jenkins, if all three of Toner, Dunne and Ryan leave.
Keith wrote: ↑January 27th, 2022, 10:01 am
Is Josh Murphy a viable option in the 2nd row? I mean I really hope so, but even Tom Denton could have looked like a world beater against Bath and Montpellier. I still feel like we could use another signing along with Jenkins, if all three of Toner, Dunne and Ryan leave.
coaches seem to think so, i'm sure we will learn more over the next few months.
they could have retained Dunne by all accounts but have adopted to go elsewhere and so far this season Toner/Dunne/Ryan have very few minutes for the senior side.
We effectively only need a player to replace Toner, which appears to be Jenkins. It would be disingenuous to suggest we need someone to replace Dunne and C. Ryan, given that neither of them actually play for us at all. They weren't even getting minutes when we had more games. The idea that we would sign someone to play the games that they would otherwise play seems off kilter with reality.
Obviously we could be hit with a load of injuries and get into trouble, but that's a bridge we will just have to cross if we come to it.
“As you all know first prize is a Cadillac El Dorado. Anyone wanna see second prize? Second prize is a set of steak knives. Third prize is you're fired.”
Dunne played 8 times last season and might have gotten more but for injuries and the way he bulked up to fill a role for us.
Jenkins will (assuming it's actually happening) cover the minutes (and then some) that Dunne and Toner provided, but that's not what we signed him for.
Jenkins has been signed for the big games. Anything he adds in the smaller fixtures is a bonus.
ronk wrote: ↑January 27th, 2022, 12:51 pm
Dunne played 8 times last season and might have gotten more but for injuries and the way he bulked up to fill a role for us.
Jenkins will (assuming it's actually happening) cover the minutes (and then some) that Dunne and Toner provided, but that's not what we signed him for.
Jenkins has been signed for the big games. Anything he adds in the smaller fixtures is a bonus.
Yes, but a sum total of 174 minutes. He played one 80 minute game, but the other 7 were for 10 minutes here and there. There just isn't a gap there that we need to fill.
“As you all know first prize is a Cadillac El Dorado. Anyone wanna see second prize? Second prize is a set of steak knives. Third prize is you're fired.”
mildlyinterested wrote: ↑January 27th, 2022, 3:44 pm
Dunne is better off going elsewhere and hopefully playing a lot of rugby and developing.
There is the concern that we've got another Tadhg Beirne scenario in the making
nothing to be done about that now, just got to make sure if Dunne turns into a potential international while playing abroad, Leinster are in a position to bring him back to the province.
