Grahamunster - Graham Rowntree's Munster 2022/2023

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riocard911
Seán Cronin
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Re: Grahamunster - Graham Rowntree's Munster 2022/2023

Post by riocard911 »

ronk wrote: June 25th, 2022, 6:56 pm
riocard911 wrote: June 25th, 2022, 5:34 pm
ronk wrote: June 25th, 2022, 3:53 pm Faz picked Tom O'Toole ahead of him. That puts him far enough down the pecking order that Munster were allowed cut him, just.

He's too old for development minutes, but he's useful. He was capped last summer against Japan and it wouldn't have taken many injuries to get him in squads.

But it forces Munster to develop Knox and means theres a softer succession plan than letting Ryan and Archer retire together. It's harsh on him but a reasonable plan.
And if Tom O'Toole or Tadhg goes down pre-RWC? I would have thought keeping a guy, who could get us out of a pickle, should one arise, at tight-head, in the provincial system and thereby eligible for the national team would have been somewhat more reasonable. But then what do I know?
I agree. I made that point when rumours of him leaving made the board.

If Faz wanted him enough he probably could have put enough pressure on Munster.

Ryan was told in December 2021 that he didn't have a contract. It wasn't that long after the autumn Internationals where Healy had been available as a tighthead.
Yeah, and half a year later everyone's speculating bout Church's durability and will he even make it to France, if Leo and Stu only trust him to do five minutes of the bench in crunch Leinster matches at the tail end of the 21/22 season..... (exaggeration for the sake of emphasis)
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ronk
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Re: Grahamunster - Graham Rowntree's Munster 2022/2023

Post by ronk »

It's still 4 tightheads he can call before he pulls Ryan into a squad. And if he told the IRFU he'd be happy to bring back Moore and/or move Porter back across in the event of a big enough squeeze then maybe there's no push to block the move.

Faz has picked O'Toole ahead of Moore and didn't pick Ryan a lot, so he seems to prioritize mobile tightheads over set piece tightheads. It's not something I entirely agree with, I think there's room to have a stronger set piece when you need one.

A lot is made of Healy's age but he's only a year older than Ryan.
Last edited by ronk on June 26th, 2022, 9:18 am, edited 1 time in total.
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paddyor
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Re: Grahamunster - Graham Rowntree's Munster 2022/2023

Post by paddyor »

riocard911 wrote: June 25th, 2022, 5:34 pm
ronk wrote: June 25th, 2022, 3:53 pm Faz picked Tom O'Toole ahead of him. That puts him far enough down the pecking order that Munster were allowed cut him, just.

He's too old for development minutes, but he's useful. He was capped last summer against Japan and it wouldn't have taken many injuries to get him in squads.

But it forces Munster to develop Knox and means theres a softer succession plan than letting Ryan and Archer retire together. It's harsh on him but a reasonable plan.
And if Tom O'Toole or Tadhg goes down pre-RWC? I would have thought keeping a guy, who could get us out of a pickle, should one arise, at tight-head, in the provincial system and thereby eligible for the national team would have been somewhat more reasonable. But then what do I know?
If they go down we’re screwed. Well go to bealham and AN other. Bealham & Ryan isn’t really much better. There’s a bealham & Moore alternative that seems just as good. Ryan out the door is good for Knox & salanoa. I don’t care if they lost Ryan over archer.
Ruddock's tackle stats consistently too low for me to be taken seriously as a Six Nations blindside..... Ruddock's defensive stats don't stack up. - All Blacks Nil, Jan 15th, 2014
England A 8 - 14 Ireland A, 25th Jan 2014
Ruddock(c) 19/2 Tackles
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ronk
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Re: Grahamunster - Graham Rowntree's Munster 2022/2023

Post by ronk »

https://www.munsterrugby.ie/2022/06/30/ ... rave-park/

fantastic-crowds-attend-mcd-concerts-at-musgrave-park/
Image

I know it's not what happened but they still put that headline with that picture on their official page.
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dropkick
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Re: Grahamunster - Graham Rowntree's Munster 2022/2023

Post by dropkick »

dropkick wrote: June 23rd, 2022, 10:40 pm.
Never saw Oliver but he must be a talent if they're bringing him in so soon.

He's actually the son of one of the munster (youth?) coaches, former Scotland International Greg Oliver.
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munster#1
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Re: Grahamunster - Graham Rowntree's Munster 2022/2023

Post by munster#1 »

Great to see some former players being kept involved and giving back to the sport.

That group of underage players are very lucky.

https://www.munsterrugby.ie/domestic_ne ... de-squads/
“Everything is Legal until you are caught” does not mean that you are not breaking the laws, it simply means that players will play the ref, and will break the laws of the game if they believe they won’t, or until they do, get caught.
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munster#1
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Re: Grahamunster - Graham Rowntree's Munster 2022/2023

Post by munster#1 »

Great to hear that RG has started his pre season.
Although he has been with Munster for a couple of seasons now, he will be like a new signing.

With himself, Kleyn, Wycherley Ahern and Beirne, Munster have some really good options in the second row, and will be in a position to mix things up when required.
A starting second row of RG and Kleyn would offer some real power against the big English and French teams.
And with a mix of either of the TH locks and Ahern or Beirne Munster can play with some serious gas around the park.
“Everything is Legal until you are caught” does not mean that you are not breaking the laws, it simply means that players will play the ref, and will break the laws of the game if they believe they won’t, or until they do, get caught.
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dropkick
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Re: Grahamunster - Graham Rowntree's Munster 2022/2023

Post by dropkick »

munster#1 wrote: July 28th, 2022, 9:23 am Great to hear that RG has started his pre season.
Although he has been with Munster for a couple of seasons now, he will be like a new signing.

With himself, Kleyn, Wycherley Ahern and Beirne, Munster have some really good options in the second row, and will be in a position to mix things up when required.
A starting second row of RG and Kleyn would offer some real power against the big English and French teams.
And with a mix of either of the TH locks and Ahern or Beirne Munster can play with some serious gas around the park.
He mentioned Paddy Kelly too in his first interview. Kelly and Eoin O'Connor are new additions from the academy, both 6'7 so decent size though EOC looks like he needs to add a bit of weight. I'm not sure how much opportunity there is for all of them to play. We might see Fineen playing more at 6 this season.
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munster#1
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Re: Grahamunster - Graham Rowntree's Munster 2022/2023

Post by munster#1 »

dropkick wrote: July 28th, 2022, 10:04 am
munster#1 wrote: July 28th, 2022, 9:23 am Great to hear that RG has started his pre season.
Although he has been with Munster for a couple of seasons now, he will be like a new signing.

With himself, Kleyn, Wycherley Ahern and Beirne, Munster have some really good options in the second row, and will be in a position to mix things up when required.
A starting second row of RG and Kleyn would offer some real power against the big English and French teams.
And with a mix of either of the TH locks and Ahern or Beirne Munster can play with some serious gas around the park.
He mentioned Paddy Kelly too in his first interview. Kelly and Eoin O'Connor are new additions from the academy, both 6'7 so decent size though EOC looks like he needs to add a bit of weight. I'm not sure how much opportunity there is for all of them to play. We might see Fineen playing more at 6 this season.
Kelly looks like a good prospect alright.
He is a very mobile second row, who will hopefully get some good gametime.
But as you say, gametime could be limited this season with few opportunities to blood players.
“Everything is Legal until you are caught” does not mean that you are not breaking the laws, it simply means that players will play the ref, and will break the laws of the game if they believe they won’t, or until they do, get caught.
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dropkick
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Re: Grahamunster - Graham Rowntree's Munster 2022/2023

Post by dropkick »

The most interesting addition for me is definitely Prendergast. I just mentioned Mike Catt on another thread and Prendergast's philosophy is similar to the way ireland attack. Larkham was known to have a complex attacking system but I think Prendergast will go the Ireland route of plenty of attacking options and giving players to play what's in front of them.
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munster#1
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Re: Grahamunster - Graham Rowntree's Munster 2022/2023

Post by munster#1 »

dropkick wrote: August 2nd, 2022, 10:38 am The most interesting addition for me is definitely Prendergast. I just mentioned Mike Catt on another thread and Prendergast's philosophy is similar to the way ireland attack. Larkham was known to have a complex attacking system but I think Prendergast will go the Ireland route of plenty of attacking options and giving players to play what's in front of them.
I am really looking forward to seeing how the Munster attack takes shape.
Prendergast has gained a wealth of knowledge in his time in France, having coached some of the biggest names in world rugby, whilst being a well thought of coach for some big clubs.

I agree with you, that Munster will likely play a very similar game plan to Ireland.
Munster have some really great options in the pack, with great hands and rugby brains, the likes of RG, Beirne, Kendellan, Coombes, POM, JOD and Loughman to name a few, so Hopefully we see a lot more interplay between backs and forwards in open play, whilst still retaining the bite up front.
“Everything is Legal until you are caught” does not mean that you are not breaking the laws, it simply means that players will play the ref, and will break the laws of the game if they believe they won’t, or until they do, get caught.
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hugonaut
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Re: Grahamunster - Graham Rowntree's Munster 2022/2023

Post by hugonaut »

Really nice article about Anton Frisch in the weekend's Irish Times, for those of you who may not have read it:
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/ ... lay-rugby/
wixfjord
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Re: Grahamunster - Graham Rowntree's Munster 2022/2023

Post by wixfjord »

Interesting! He clearly has an actual real connection to Ireland.

Never knowingly seen the guy play, but according to Bristol fans and Lam he's a big talent.

Will be interesting to see how he's used given Farrell/Fekitoa won't be missing barring injury. He seems to be a different sort of option to both of them though.

Would imagine he'll go straight in and replace Scannell/Goggin in the pecking order.
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munster#1
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Re: Grahamunster - Graham Rowntree's Munster 2022/2023

Post by munster#1 »

Frisch will provide some really good depth in the middle of the park, and I doubt he is coming to Munster to just make up the numbers.

He will be pushing hard for inclusion in the Irish squad for the RWC. I’m not saying that he is good enough to make it, as I have limited knowledge of the guy, and he will have to get passed Farrell, which won’t be easy, but this can only benefit Munster.
“Everything is Legal until you are caught” does not mean that you are not breaking the laws, it simply means that players will play the ref, and will break the laws of the game if they believe they won’t, or until they do, get caught.
wixfjord
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Re: Grahamunster - Graham Rowntree's Munster 2022/2023

Post by wixfjord »

munster#1 wrote: August 3rd, 2022, 10:15 am Frisch will provide some really good depth in the middle of the park, and I doubt he is coming to Munster to just make up the numbers.

He will be pushing hard for inclusion in the Irish squad for the RWC. I’m not saying that he is good enough to make it, as I have limited knowledge of the guy, and he will have to get passed Farrell, which won’t be easy, but this can only benefit Munster.
Less and less subtle...
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ronk
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Re: Grahamunster - Graham Rowntree's Munster 2022/2023

Post by ronk »

munster#1 wrote: August 3rd, 2022, 10:15 am Frisch will provide some really good depth in the middle of the park, and I doubt he is coming to Munster to just make up the numbers.

He will be pushing hard for inclusion in the Irish squad for the RWC. I’m not saying that he is good enough to make it, as I have limited knowledge of the guy, and he will have to get passed Farrell, which won’t be easy
, but this can only benefit Munster.
That's right
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hugonaut
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Re: Grahamunster - Graham Rowntree's Munster 2022/2023

Post by hugonaut »

wixfjord wrote: August 3rd, 2022, 9:43 am Would imagine he'll go straight in and replace Scannell/Goggin in the pecking order.
I think Scannell is a good player. It's extremely likely that Fekitoa is an upgrade on him [24 All Black caps in an outstandingly strong period for New Zealand, between 2014-17], but Scannell has always impressed me as a competent and skillful player.

From my perspective, he's a completely different class to Goggin. If I was doing contracts in Munster I would have cut Goggin at least two years ago, if not earlier. Doesn't bring anything different or special to the squad at all.
wixfjord
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Re: Grahamunster - Graham Rowntree's Munster 2022/2023

Post by wixfjord »

hugonaut wrote: August 3rd, 2022, 1:21 pm
wixfjord wrote: August 3rd, 2022, 9:43 am Would imagine he'll go straight in and replace Scannell/Goggin in the pecking order.
I think Scannell is a good player. It's extremely likely that Fekitoa is an upgrade on him [24 All Black caps in an outstandingly strong period for New Zealand, between 2014-17], but Scannell has always impressed me as a competent and skillful player.

From my perspective, he's a completely different class to Goggin. If I was doing contracts in Munster I would have cut Goggin at least two years ago, if not earlier. Doesn't bring anything different or special to the squad at all.
Worth watching Goggin's action for the try that Foley finished in the Aviva last season. He literally looks like a tired TH prop in the midfield. Frawley's line was class but still.
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Re: Grahamunster - Graham Rowntree's Munster 2022/2023

Post by leinsterforever »

I think there could be something there with Goggin as a 12. He's physical and is a good passer. He's fairly limited as a 13, in my opinion. It'd be interesting to see him under good attack coaching.

I think Frisch might be being a bit overhyped. He's played very little top level rugby for a 26-year old.
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munster#1
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Re: Grahamunster - Graham Rowntree's Munster 2022/2023

Post by munster#1 »

wixfjord wrote: August 3rd, 2022, 11:55 am
munster#1 wrote: August 3rd, 2022, 10:15 am Frisch will provide some really good depth in the middle of the park, and I doubt he is coming to Munster to just make up the numbers.

He will be pushing hard for inclusion in the Irish squad for the RWC. I’m not saying that he is good enough to make it, as I have limited knowledge of the guy, and he will have to get passed Farrell, which won’t be easy, but this can only benefit Munster.
Less and less subtle...
Will you get over yourself.

Saying that a player will be pushing for inclusion in an Irish squad can only be perceived as a wind up by someone that is …………….

If you believe he, or any other IQ player won’t be doing everything in their power to put their hand up for selection, then you are delusional.
“Everything is Legal until you are caught” does not mean that you are not breaking the laws, it simply means that players will play the ref, and will break the laws of the game if they believe they won’t, or until they do, get caught.
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