Grahamunster - Graham Rowntree's Munster 2022/2023

[munster#1]

Great to see that Munster will be hosting 11 concerts over the summer.

Musgrave has shown some real value with 2 sold out matches during the U20s 6 nations, and will hopefully host 8 sold out gigs during the summer.

Those matches/events along with 3 sold out gigs at TP will be provide a massive financial boost at an opportune time.

Hopefully Munster can also drive on and earn a home quarter in the URC to add to the bottom line.

Assume they get a trophy for hosting the 11 concerts?

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Strange assumption.

[naraic]

Great to see that Munster will be hosting 11 concerts over the summer.

Musgrave has shown some real value with 2 sold out matches during the U20s 6 nations, and will hopefully host 8 sold out gigs during the summer.

Those matches/events along with 3 sold out gigs at TP will be provide a massive financial boost at an opportune time.

Hopefully Munster can also drive on and earn a home quarter in the URC to add to the bottom line.

Fair play to the back office workers who made this happen.

Theres money in that and that's needed when trying to make a province work.

I've often criticised Munster's board for ignoring financial matters but they aren't doing that at the moment.

A couple of sold out stadiums could help Munster rugby if they go to the market selling naming rights too as it would increase the profile of the stadium.

If you have two stadiums you need to make them work for more than just Rugby and they seem to be doing that.

[munster#1]

Great to see that Munster will be hosting 11 concerts over the summer.

Musgrave has shown some real value with 2 sold out matches during the U20s 6 nations, and will hopefully host 8 sold out gigs during the summer.

Those matches/events along with 3 sold out gigs at TP will be provide a massive financial boost at an opportune time.

Hopefully Munster can also drive on and earn a home quarter in the URC to add to the bottom line.

Fair play to the back office workers who made this happen.

Theres money in that and that's needed when trying to make a province work.

I've often criticised Munster's board for ignoring financial matters but they aren't doing that at the moment.

A couple of sold out stadiums could help Munster rugby if they go to the market selling naming rights too as it would increase the profile of the stadium.

If you have two stadiums you need to make them work for more than just Rugby and they seem to be doing that.

You hit the nail on the head.
It’s the financial impact of these concerts which should be celebrated.

Munster are forever being criticised for being a financial drain on the IRFU, and concerts like these, along with the ongoing cost reductions which will make Munster financially competitive.

Musgrave park is a net contributor to Munster’s bottom line.
If TP can host several concerts a year, they it to will turn into a real asset.

Good point on the naming rights. That has the potential to bring in considerable investment into the club.

[hugonaut]

A couple of sold out stadiums could help Munster rugby if they go to the market selling naming rights too as it would increase the profile of the stadium.

If you have two stadiums you need to make them work for more than just Rugby and they seem to be doing that.

Naming rights for the fifteen year old stadium of a team who haven't won anything in over a decade? That's not going to bring in meaningful money.

The time to sell the naming rights of Thomond Park was when it opened in 2008, when Munster were European champions. That was a huge opportunity to capitalise on the completion of the stadium and their status in the game, and it was passed over.

I can understand the line of thinking that wanted to keep the historic name, but on the other hand, that commercial opportunity is gone. Forever.

[naraic]

A couple of sold out stadiums could help Munster rugby if they go to the market selling naming rights too as it would increase the profile of the stadium.

If you have two stadiums you need to make them work for more than just Rugby and they seem to be doing that.

Naming rights for the fifteen year old stadium of a team who haven't won anything in over a decade? That's not going to bring in meaningful money.

The time to sell the naming rights of Thomond Park was when it opened in 2008, when Munster were European champions. That was a huge opportunity to capitalise on the completion of the stadium and their status in the game, and it was passed over.

I can understand the line of thinking that wanted to keep the historic name, but on the other hand, that commercial opportunity is gone. Forever.

Completely agreed.

I remember reading an estimate of 750K a year for 10 years as being on the table in 2008.

Now they would be talking 300K-350K a year at best. I just mentioned it as it was mentioned in the papers last summer that the Munster board was looking at selling them again.

When you have 8 home games in thomond (between league and Europe) and maybe two of them sell out three sold out concerts is a meaningful contribution to the value of the stadium.

[munster#1]

A couple of sold out stadiums could help Munster rugby if they go to the market selling naming rights too as it would increase the profile of the stadium.

If you have two stadiums you need to make them work for more than just Rugby and they seem to be doing that.

Naming rights for the fifteen year old stadium of a team who haven't won anything in over a decade? That's not going to bring in meaningful money.

The time to sell the naming rights of Thomond Park was when it opened in 2008, when Munster were European champions. That was a huge opportunity to capitalise on the completion of the stadium and their status in the game, and it was passed over.

I can understand the line of thinking that wanted to keep the historic name, but on the other hand, that commercial opportunity is gone. Forever.

Completely agreed.

I remember reading an estimate of 750K a year for 10 years as being on the table in 2008.

Now they would be talking 300K-350K a year at best. I just mentioned it as it was mentioned in the papers last summer that the Munster board was looking at selling them again.

When you have 8 home games in thomond (between league and Europe) and maybe two of them sell out three sold out concerts is a meaningful contribution to the value of the stadium.

Just because you say something with enough conviction does not make it fact.
Saying that the commercial opportunity is now gone is a fairly stupid comment to make.(In relation to the quote you responded to, not yours)

There will likely be a reduction in the Munster market value due to their fall from the top and the fact that the stadium is no longer new, but that does not mean that the naming rights does not have a value, which you accept in your comment.

Munster are currently have the largest TV market if any club in the URC. That on it’s own has a value.
If you read the comments on here, they also get much more media coverage than the other provinces, which again adds to the value.

Of course the value, or potential value of selling the naming rights would have to be traded off against who their partner is, and what the contractual obligations dictate.

[Dave Cahill]

A couple of sold out stadiums could help Munster rugby if they go to the market selling naming rights too as it would increase the profile of the stadium.

If you have two stadiums you need to make them work for more than just Rugby and they seem to be doing that.

Naming rights for the fifteen year old stadium of a team who haven't won anything in over a decade? That's not going to bring in meaningful money.

The time to sell the naming rights of Thomond Park was when it opened in 2008, when Munster were European champions. That was a huge opportunity to capitalise on the completion of the stadium and their status in the game, and it was passed over.

I can understand the line of thinking that wanted to keep the historic name, but on the other hand, that commercial opportunity is gone. Forever.

Completely agreed.

I remember reading an estimate of 750K a year for 10 years as being on the table in 2008.

Now they would be talking 300K-350K a year at best. I just mentioned it as it was mentioned in the papers last summer that the Munster board was looking at selling them again.

When you have 8 home games in thomond (between league and Europe) and maybe two of them sell out three sold out concerts is a meaningful contribution to the value of the stadium.

It was 15m for 10 years with multiple offers at that price. The rate for an existing stadium as opposed to new build is between a quarter to a third of the new build value. Muster placed the property with Onsite a couple of years ago, an agency that specialises in naming rights, but couldn't get any significant interest

[ronk]

The commercial opportunity is gone, both because the potential value of a naming deal is so much less and also because a new naming deal isn’t going to back pay the last 15 years when it didn’t have a sponsor.

[munster#1]

Some strange positions to take.
To say that the commercial opportunity is gone is one thing, but to try to justify that by saying the reason is because they can’t collect revenue for previous years, is batty.

That’s like saying, sure Munster shouldn’t look to host concerts going forward because of lost potential revenue from not doing so in previous years.

Even if Munster were to only get €500k per year, that is €500k which they don’t currently have.
This would be the same for any figure, so long as the contractual obligations are not overly restrictive.

If they sell the name or not, Munster are still in a very positive position right now, due to the ownership of 2 stadiums, with both stadiums set to make a combined additional 7 figures in revenue from non rugby related activity.
When you consider that they loan repayments for TP are just €100k pa. that is a serious boost to their finances.

The only issue now is for the marketing teams to continue with their efforts and look to sustain this level of activity, or better still, increase the level of activity.

[Oldschool]

Leinster aren't exactly in a position to lecture anyone else about their Stadia.
We don't have our own stadium so no naming rights and no extracurricular events.
Is their any rugby site in Dublin where a 20,000 plus stadium could be built, would the numbers stack up, can we get the naming rights for the RDS for rugby only events.
We seem to be currently hitching our wagon to the RDS anyway.

[IanD]

Leinster aren't exactly in a position to lecture anyone else about their Stadia.
We don't have our own stadium so no naming rights and no extracurricular events.
Is their any rugby site in Dublin where a 20,000 plus stadium could be built, would the numbers stack up, can we get the naming rights for the RDS for rugby only events.
We seem to be currently hitching our wagon to the RDS anyway.

You are forgetting Energia Park.

[Oldschool]

Leinster aren't exactly in a position to lecture anyone else about their Stadia.
We don't have our own stadium so no naming rights and no extracurricular events.
Is their any rugby site in Dublin where a 20,000 plus stadium could be built, would the numbers stack up, can we get the naming rights for the RDS for rugby only events.
We seem to be currently hitching our wagon to the RDS anyway.

You are forgetting Energia Park.

I'm not, it's just not big enough in the context of the discussion here.

[IanD]

Leinster aren't exactly in a position to lecture anyone else about their Stadia.
We don't have our own stadium so no naming rights and no extracurricular events.
Is their any rugby site in Dublin where a 20,000 plus stadium could be built, would the numbers stack up, can we get the naming rights for the RDS for rugby only events.
We seem to be currently hitching our wagon to the RDS anyway.

You are forgetting Energia Park.

I'm not, it's just not big enough in the context of the discussion here.

You said we don't have a stadium. We do.

You said we can't sell naming rights. We did.

It might not be big enough but you are moving the goalposts afterwards.

Energia Park is great for the odd concert and smaller crowds at A games etc. Saves us forking out to rent the RDS for a small attendance eg. against Chile.

In this context it is our Musgrave Park

[Oldschool]

You are forgetting Energia Park.

I'm not, it's just not big enough in the context of the discussion here.

You said we don't have a stadium. We do.

You said we can't sell naming rights. We did.

It might not be big enough but you are moving the goalposts afterwards.

Energia Park is great for the odd concert and smaller crowds at A games etc. Saves us forking out to rent the RDS for a small attendance eg. against Chile.

In this context it is our Musgrave Park

No you moved the Goalposts.
Leinster don't used Energia Park for their home games.
So it's not our Musgrave Park even.
Which is not to say, as you point out, that EP isn't a useful piece of real estate, A games etc

[munster#1]

My reasons behind posting positives about Munster was not to offend anyone, or to start a pissing contest.

Off field, Munster are performing better than they have in the past, which is something that should be celebrated, and not used as a stick to beat anyone with, including what happened in the past.

Munster, through their stadia are now generating a considerable income in both non rugby related activities and from hosting the Ireland U20s.

Hosting 8 concerts in 2023 and 7 in 2022 in Musgrave park highlights the potential market for TP.
If TP can be utilised for more concerts throughout the summer, then Munster could well be looking at bringing in substantial additional income on a regular basis.

In terms of naming rights, any income from this has to be seen as a positive.

[ronk]

There's not a lot of point in comparing Munster and Leinster in terms of concert and event revenue. Even if we got that for Showgrounds, we'd still be around the corner from HQ and would have to defer to them in terms of not directly competing.

For me it's unquestionably a good thing that Munster are making use of an area of their commercial potential after some well documented missteps and I hope that it helps put them on a sounder financial footing. Concert revenue was, I understand, always part of the financial planning when the 2 venues were renovated so it's not a windfall.

Concerts came into the conversation because the Ed Sheeran gig happened at a terrible time in the rugby calendar and it wasn't well planned for.

[munster#1]

Great to see Munster expanding their initiative for Centres of excellence.
Munster will build a full sized indoor pitch along with an full sized outdoor pitch along with gym and other facilities, for use in the development of grass roots rugby.

https://www.live95fm.ie/news/live95-new ... -rosbrein/

[sunshiner1]

by munster#1

Great to see Munster expanding their initiative for Centres of excellence.
Munster will build a full sized indoor pitch along with an full sized outdoor pitch along with gym and other facilities, for use in the development of grass roots rugby.

https://www.live95fm.ie/news/live95-new ... -rosbrein/

Hopefully this is the shot in the arm Limerick Rugby needs to consistently start producing players again. Apparently it's close to Old Cresecent RFC too. Hope this works out.

[munster#1]

by munster#1

Great to see Munster expanding their initiative for Centres of excellence.
Munster will build a full sized indoor pitch along with an full sized outdoor pitch along with gym and other facilities, for use in the development of grass roots rugby.

https://www.live95fm.ie/news/live95-new ... -rosbrein/

Hopefully this is the shot in the arm Limerick Rugby needs to consistently start producing players again. Apparently it's close to Old Cresecent RFC too. Hope this works out.

Yes, it will be very close to Old Crescent RFC, which is not far from Garryowen and Crescent College, and also just off of the M20 and M7, which makes it accessible.

[Oldschool]

by munster#1

Great to see Munster expanding their initiative for Centres of excellence.
Munster will build a full sized indoor pitch along with an full sized outdoor pitch along with gym and other facilities, for use in the development of grass roots rugby.

https://www.live95fm.ie/news/live95-new ... -rosbrein/

Hopefully this is the shot in the arm Limerick Rugby needs to consistently start producing players again. Apparently it's close to Old Cresecent RFC too. Hope this works out.

Have Connacht anything like this or anything planned